Want to Go To Cuba via Personal Boat

[Popup]

Hello Mates [smiley=pirate.gif] We're looking for any info anyone may have of going to Cuba via personal boat from the Keys. It is my understanding that going there is not the restriction but spending money there is. *Getting into the Cuban Marina is not the problem getting past the USCG *[smiley=policeman.gif] is. We intend on having nothing on board that will indicated Cuba as a destination instead itinerary on Mexico. Our fear is not of traveling in a 20' boat but of having the boat confiscated even is they think that your going to Cuba and the confiscation is with undue process. This doesn't feel much like freedom *[smiley=huh2.gif] Anyone out ther have any recent experience or anything to add to help out. We're gonna try soon [smiley=sweatdrop.gif]

[mellisas]

met a few folk in cuba last year who had come cuba by boat...

some stop in on there way round the world...

l spoke to one guy who had had some hassles with paper work,but most said they had'nt had problems..

when do you plan to go popup..

[Popup]

Plan to Go Before the summer Hot Months Our family there has no A/C [smiley=sombrero.gif]

[mellisas]

good plan it can get very hot...

were will you be leaving from...

[mellisas]

hav'nt heard of any money retrictions ???

[Popup]

The restriction is you can only take $50- per day for food and transportation. We were just in Cuba in Sept. We of course did not go with the New regulation of $50- per day and only 14 day stay every 3 years we went with a Jewish group under their lic. We Carried Bibles & everything and we took much more money than that. The reason for the $50- limitation is so you don't spend on Hotel and support The Cuban Government. Your also allowed on top of the $50/day and extra $25- for a taxi to return to the airport. Generious isn't it ??[smiley=smug.gif]

[Popup]

Yes It's what connected me to this forum and has nothing else but Thanks

[mellisas]

mmm the boat site is'nt working...

is this your boat or are you going with a group ...

just been reading on the web about group boat trips..

[mellisas]

l hope there are some guys who can help ya here...

l hav'nt got a clue about taking a boat to cuba...

but l really am learing quite alot latley about these religious holidays :D

[mellisas]

when l come to think of it l have seen a few people

carrying a small bible along with the lonley planet. :-/

[underadar]

popup, 20 footer thats awlful small for that trip :o but I bet you know more than me about seamanship. Met a couple of captians at Hemmingway marina in Havana last year. Really nice place, its like a big country club. Those guys were stuck due to rough seas for a couple of days. They said the coast guard wanted to know why they were so far south, said they were chasing some fish.

Another who was bringing back a boat full of cigars said they time the arrival back to Keys in the middle of the night. They get cleared over the radio by customs in another state.

I bet its not too hard to find a captian arount key west who knows the scoop. Have a safe trip ;D

[cubafish]

mel: *before I get to the boat stuff, you have seen people carrying the LP Guide to Cuba AND a Bible? *Wonder why? *Are they praying the information in the LP Guide is correct or are these people just religious zelots? ???

[mellisas]

well now l wonder...

as far as the lp guide is concerned l have read that sometimes it can be mmm ..well for the want of a better word ...dated.

which to be fair is quite understandable being it is only issued every year of is it every 2 years.

l emailed them something about their info when we returned from cuba last year...

we went on one for the so called leisurely walks.



it was more like a combat excersise... :o :o

walked for miles...

then it was up hill and down dale


walking on unstable surfaces ...

l ened up coming down one of the steep decent on my you know what...

good job l was'nt clinging to the quide at that moment else he would have come with me

mel said ya sure found the quick way down... ::)

it was scary...

the bibles ...well that is another nest of vipers...

after talking to a few folk and reading some posts ...not all people that take religious holiday are religious...

[cubafish]

I go by boat 1-2 times/year (from Cayo Hueso) and have for the past 11 years so I have a little knowledge in this area. *There is lots of misinformation, some bad information, and a little good information above.

1. It is my understanding that going there is not the restriction but spending money is. *Well, that is the way it usedto be, but that all changed after July 1, 2004. *Now you are required to (1)have a license issued by OFAC after July 1, 2004, and (2)have a permission slip from the USCG issued within 30 days of your trip, and (3)have an approval letter issued by the US Department of Commerce issued within 30 days of you trip.

Yes, getting by the big USCG boat that hangs out +/- 15 miles south of Key West is a problem. *They may stop you but will not confiscate your boat, but they will have photo evidence of your presence on the date you depart, thus having nothing on board indicating Cuba as your destination is not an issue as your chances of a CG search are very slim - but will the rod holders on your boat be full of fishing rods - big heavy duty fishing rods? *If not, why are you 15 miles offshore without fishing rods that are capeable of catching a marlin or big yellowfin tuna that are found in that area? <- that really makes no matter as US customs and Immigration has a super secret geo stationary satellite above the Florida Straits (similar to the geo stationary satellite the US military uses over Iraq), that tracks all boats going to Cuba, and this satellite has the capeability to identify your boat the same as if someone was on the dock next to your boat, day or night. *While you stand almost no chance of your boat being confiscated while going to Cuba, you stand a good chance of it being confiscated on your return - my opinion a 50/50 chance. *You will increase your chances of coming back without being caught if you can time your departure from Marina Hemingway to come back with several other boats that are capeable of the same speed as your boat <- that way they may choose to stop you and they may choose to stop one of the other boats. *You takes your chances . * . * . * .

Confiscate your boat with undue process? *Who in your group came up with that statement - obviously after someone had had a few beers, or someone who knows nothing about what they are talking about. *FYI the OFAC regulation are just that, regulations, not statutes, and the OFAC Regulations do not need to comply with anything related to undue process.

Mexico. *Are you serious? *Are you so naive to think anyone will believe you are going to Mexico in a 20 ft boat? *This is one of the funniest things you have said. *::)

Still think you know what you are contemplating doing?

Read on.

[cubafish]

Clearing into Cuba is no problem. *They want your dollars (money) so they know the value of your being in Cuba so you can spend money. *Clearing in by boat is somewhat of a frustrating and protracted procedure but what the hell, es Cuba. * 8)

Plan to Go Before the summer Hot Months. *Well who hatched that bad idea? *Why is it a bad idea? *Because the summers hot months also mean calm seas, whereas non-summer months generally mean rough seas. *Crossing to Cuba in a 20 ft boat in rough seas is a recipe for disaster and quite possibly will turn you into a rafter, assuming your 20 ft'r has flotation. *Want to see what the US Coast Guard does best? *Then cross to Cuba in rough seas and experience how the USCG rescues people. * :o

The restriction is you can only take $50 * . * . * . * we went with a Jewish group *Well wasen't it nice that you had a religious experience. *And all of a sudden this trip makes you an expert on traveling to Cuba. *FYI the New $50 limit on expenditures that was imposed July 1, 2004 applies ONLY to those travelers who have a license to travel to Cuba post July 1, 2004 (ie. your Jewish group). *Or in other words, the $50 limit on expenditures and the extra $25 allowance has no bearing on your proposed trip. * >:(

Some of underadars information is good. *But his information about clearing into US Customs and Immigration via phone with an agent from another state in the US is old information as this has not been possible since 9/11/02. *Upon returning by boat you will be lucky enough to have a personal interview with (1)US Customs, (2)US Immigration, (3)US Department of Agriculture, and (4)US Department of Commerce, and it is highly likely that US Customs will confiscate the boat.* :-X

I don't mean to sound negative, but you have a misconception of what you can and cannot do as a US citizen traveling to Cuba by boat and I hope my replies will help you in your quest to visit the island.

Questions * ???

[sailor]

I too have made several trips to Marina Hemingway. We had always made port in another country before returning to US. Never admitted to officials of having made port in Cuba. In years past we had applied for and received permission with restrictions to go to Cuba but since July 2004 these reasons have been removed from the list thanks to G.W. and his cronnies. I understand that they requested Mr Casons (top dog at state dept. office in Havana) remove his nice sportfishing boat from Marina Hemingway after he arrived.

Large sailboat cruising a large circle route through three countries tends to make it difficult to be tracked by eyes in the sky as long as you do not attract attention by taking obscure routes where smugglers would frequent (that would be very stupid for several reasons).

A 20 foot boat in the straights of Florida? Not me my friend!! I am sure it has been done but this part of the ocean can very quickly become very unfriendly. I know, I have been there!

[mellisas]

sounds like risky bisso to me...

must be so exciting..

got room for a stowaway... ;D

[greslogo]

Two U.S. boaters detained in Cuba

Associated Press

MIAMI - Two U.S. residents have been detained in Cuba after a friend
reported them missing on their 22-foot boat, but how they reached Cuban
waters is unclear.

A man called the Coast Guard on Feb. 5 to report his friends were in
trouble at sea.

He "had been in contact with the two individuals by satellite phone. We
talked to this friend to try to get a position. He was telling us they
were in distress and adrift, basically broken down," said Coast Guard
Lt. Tony Russell.

The initial location he offered was near Crooked Island in the Bahamas,
but "that just didn't make any sense," Russell said. "The second
location given was 18 miles off the coast of Cuba, and then 45 minutes
later it was 1,200 yards off the coast of Cuba."

That's when the man said his friends had been stopped by Cuban border
guards. The boaters' names have not been released.

Russell had no explanation for the boat trip, but U.S.-registered boats
are required to get permits to enter the waters off Cuba.

"What I can comfortably say is the nature of the reporting and the
inconsistency of the reports are very consistent with similar cases with
similar people we do believe are engaged in smuggling," Russell said.

Small power boats with extra fuel are used by Florida boaters to
illegally smuggle people out of Cuba.

"We've seen these reports that there are these two individuals being
detained in Cuba," Richard Boucher, a State Department spokesman, said
Friday in Washington. "We're still looking into them and trying to
ascertain the whereabouts of these individuals and see if there is
anything we can do on their behalf."

[mellisas]

Two U.S. boaters detained in Cuba

Associated Press

MIAMI - Two U.S. residents have been detained in Cuba after a friend
reported them missing on their 22-foot boat, but how they reached Cuban
waters is unclear.

A man called the Coast Guard on Feb. 5 to report his friends were in
trouble at sea.

He "had been in contact with the two individuals by satellite phone. We
talked to this friend to try to get a position. He was telling us they
were in distress and adrift, basically broken down," said Coast Guard
Lt. Tony Russell.

The initial location he offered was near Crooked Island in the Bahamas,
but "that just didn't make any sense," Russell said. "The second
location given was 18 miles off the coast of Cuba, and then 45 minutes
later it was 1,200 yards off the coast of Cuba."

That's when the man said his friends had been stopped by Cuban border
guards. The boaters' names have not been released.

Russell had no explanation for the boat trip, but U.S.-registered boats
are required to get permits to enter the waters off Cuba.

"What I can comfortably say is the nature of the reporting and the
inconsistency of the reports are very consistent with similar cases with
similar people we do believe are engaged in smuggling," Russell said.

Small power boats with extra fuel are used by Florida boaters to
illegally smuggle people out of Cuba.

"We've seen these reports that there are these two individuals being
detained in Cuba," Richard Boucher, a State Department spokesman, said
Friday in Washington. "We're still looking into them and trying to
ascertain the whereabouts of these individuals and see if there is
anything we can do on their behalf."


cubafish..sailor are you guys ok...

ya not checking in from a cuban prison are you :o :o

if your still there in may l will stop by with some tucker..

that sopa de agua can be a bit thin sometimes ;)

[cubafish]

Sailors routine is the best - when departing Marina Hemingway go to another country first prior to returning to the US. That way you have the intervening countries entrance and exit stamp in your passport (as Cuba does not stamp passports) and "oh yes Mr. US Immigration Officer, we have been in Belize for the past 4 weeks." ;)

[cubafish]

The boat described in the article mentioned by gres and mel is likely a people smugging boat. *People smuggling is big business due to it being much safer and faster than someone trying to get to the US by raft, but the Cuban authorities have boats on alert at night trying to catch the smugglers boats and this is likely what happened in this case. *The going rate for a fast seaworthy boat leaving from the middle or lower Florida Keys and going over to Cuba to pick up family or friends of Cuban Americans already in the US is a minimum of $8,000 per person and the boats that make this run are capeable of safely bring back 10-15 people. *For the mathametically challenged that is an $80,000-120,000 nightly paycheck with a cost to the smuggler of +/- $600 in fuel. *The cash only fee is paid 1/2 prior to the boat leaving and the other 1/2, also in cash upon the boat arriving back in south Florida. *

Rates as high as $25,000 per person have been rumored paid by very wealthy Cuban Americals who want special service, such as a receltly smuggled Cuban baseball player who is now making several million dollars playing baseball in the US. *The boating grapevine said this baseball player paid $75,000 to have his wife and 2 children smuggled into the US last fall on a "special run," just to pick up his 3 family members. *Most of the runs to Cuba depart Marathon or Key West at dark and take 10 or so hours to complete at a time of night when there are virtually no US patrol boats on the water. *The pick up points in Cuba are pre-arranged at a location usually between Matanzas and the Cayos north of Remedios. *With good weather and no complications the smugglers boats are back in the Florida Keys with their precious cargo several hours before sunrise.

Although in the article one of the boaters said they were near Crooked Island (located in the southern Bahamas, fairly close to Cuba) that story is highly unlikely. *IMO what happened is this: *The US Customs, Immigration, and DEA (Drug interdiction) Departments have a super secret satellite in geo stationary orbit over the Florida Straits similar to ones the US Military are using over Iraq. *These satellites have very powerful telescopes and cameras that are capeable of seeing people walking on land during daylight hours, and have heat sensing ability so that among other things they can do, at night they can track boats they cannot see going from the lower Florida Keys to Cuba. *People smuggling is one area where the US government and Cuban authorities are cooperating with each other and in my opinion the US spotted this boat as it departed the lower Florida Keys, alerted Cuban authorities of its course and speed (with which they can predict with reasonable accuracy where and when the boat will make landfall in Cuba), and passed this information to Cuban authorities. *Then with the information passed to the Cuban Guarda Frontera, fumble fucders that they are, they were *able to apprehend the vessel.

[sailor]

Ah yes, the guardia frontera. I have been aboard a couple of the boats they use for patrols. They were small outboard runabouts less than 20 ft. with a motor that looked like it was on its last leg of life. The guys were very happy to have them because they had waited for months to get them. Seeing these boats was like taking a walk back in time they were so old and feable. One of them didn't have any floorboards and when you stepped between the ribs the skin of the hull would actually flex with my weight.

These were used for routine patrols and when they would go out they were only allowed enough fuel to get to the next destination about 20 or 30 miles away. Only a compass for navigation and a radio to call in if they saw something suspicious.

They also have some fast ribs and medium gunboats but keep them under wraps for use when something is reported from the dinky patrols.

In addition to the geo-stationary eye above, there is Fat Albert in Key West. A balloon mounted radar set the Navy has for looking over the horizon. I don't remember the exact range of this system but it can watch traffic from Havana to Naples, FL to the NW Cay Sal Bank. Like any radar system, the farther away from it the less it sees.

The FLorida Straights are a treacherous place because of a combination of things. First there is the Gulf Stream. It flows in a West to East direction curving North up the East coast of Florida. It's variable speed (2-4 knots)is determined by weather patterns in the Caribbean Sea, Gulf of Mexico and the Straights themselves. This current is very strong right up to the entrance to the harbor at Havana and Marina Hemingway. Most of you have seen the waves crashing over the Malecon. This is a very subdued version of what is farther out. Second is the prevailing wind, predominantly from the East Southeast. These winds can change in intensity in the course of the day and try to push the water surface in the opposite direction of the Gulf Stream creating some very steep seas. The kind that like to flip little 20 foot trailerable boats upside down if not handled properly or if the engine should fail just over the horizon from Cuba.

Weather South of Cuba can change rapidly and we do not have any weather stations monitoring conditions there. Key West weather radar may present a pretty picture while a tempest is brewing just a few miles South of Cuba and moving North at 15-20 MPH. About the same speed a boat would be going South from Key West. We have all seen and heard about squalls. Not many have seen them from a 20 foot boat where the closest land is over a thousand feet.......straight down! Not a place most people would want to be.

I have been fortunate to have traveled these waters many times aboard several different boats. Things like autopilots, GPS navigation systems, weather radar, weather fax receivers, liferafts and Emergency Position Indicating Beacons are standard equipment for seafarers today. I wouldn't leave home port without it. I have also been doing this since before we had these things available where a navigator used a stopwatch and a prayer. This type of navigation is called "Dead Reckoning" for a reason.

Your worries seem to be about officials in government positions. Trust me when I say they are nothing compared to the thoughts you will have when you notice the size of the holes you bit in your underwear when and if you complete your passage across the Straights of Florida in a twenty foot boat.

[greslogo]

I remember seeing, about 6 years ago, a large sailboat, maybe 60 foot, aground outside the entrance to Marina Hemingway. 3 months later, it was still there.

Isn't that Fat Albert balloon the transmitter for Radio Marti or is that a different one ?

[sailor]

It has been some time since I had closer ties with this stuff but a few years back Fat Albert was strictly Navy. Radio Marti was different funding out of Miami with a transmitting tower in South Florida.

Funny thing about equipment funded and operated by different organizations. They don't share their toys. Fat Albert may see smuggling going on but won't say or do anything because the administrators haven't received a political advantage for this. Homeland security was supposed to eliminate the "My toy, Your toy" attitude but I doubt it has made more than a slight difference in the amount of sharing the agencies actually do. And most of what is shared has more serious implications than normal people seeking freedom.

As an example, I used to file a float plan with the USCG when I went to Cuba. They would reply giving me an approved time period for this float plan. They did not care in the least if I was licensed to go there or not. That was a different agency that had different funding for enforcing that law. So it turned out to be all about who was getting the funding to enforce this law or that law.

I believe it is still that way to a certain extent. Unless you show up in places that are hot spots in the homeland security radar screen it is business as usual.

[sailor]

BTW I haven't run ANY boats aground for a long long time so please don't assume I had anything to do with that.

[sailor]

You are right greslogo. That Fat Albert is in fact the transmiting antenna for Television Marti. Radio Marti uses a tower in Marathon. There is a large radar system mounted on Fat Albert. This radar is used primarily for aircraft detection but is capable of detecting vessels also. They just don't.

This is from a web page I found on this balloon flying over Key West:

"The TV Marti signal is unconventional. Information now rains down into Cuba on three channels. Since the balloon moves like a kite at 10,000 feet, the payload compensates by panning its TV beam to lock on the target. The combination of Fat Albert, three channels and herky-jerky movement has Castro’s jammers gagging to stop the truth from connecting with viewers."


TV Marti is broadcast in the wee hours of the night (3:30 A.M. - 8:00 A.M.) and the video is easily jammed so it can't be viewed in spite of what the politicos say and spend on this useless system.

G.W. tried transmiting TV Marti for a few hours from a C-130 cargo plane back in Aug 04 but apparently nobody knew about it so nobody watched.

Radio and TV Marti is a piece of hardware driven by the efforts of the CANF.

Has anyone here ever viewed it?

[jackd]

Cuba's jammers have a very sophisticated system for blocking Radio Marti....................



I was told by a reliable source that in the wee hrs when RM is broadcasting, they just turn off the electricity ::)

[cubafish]

sailor - FYI Fat Albert and the geo stationery satellite talk to each other. The radar in Fat Albert has incredible range and can see further than most people would believe - from as far north as Texas/Lousiana/Florida, and as far south as the northern coastline of South America. It can track over 300 "targets" and follow tham all the way from Columbia to Corpus Criste(sp?) Texas.

Fat Albert is controlled by a joint military program now run primarily by the Air Force but other services are involved, including the DEA and I'm sure Homeland Security. I think information gathered by Fat Albert is now shared among agencies, but I could be wrong about this as I have had no contact there post 9/11.

Don't know about getting holes in your underware while crossing from Key West to Havana in a 20 ft boat, but am sure the underware will be soiled. ;D

gres: Vessels running aground on the reef bordering the entrance to Marina Hemingway is almost a daily occurance by foreign vessels who do not possess or have not read one of the cruising guides that tell you how to enter the marina.
Fat Albert is not connected with transmissions relating to Radio Marti - that broadcast comes from Loggerhead Key in the Dry Tortugas (located 70 miles west of Key West) and interestingly from a 3 1/2 floppy disk. I know because I changed the disk once - it's changed every 2 weeks. <- that was several years ago so I can't comment with any authority on Sailors statement that this broadcast now comes from a tower in Marathon -= it's possible he is right. Also do not know where the TV broadcasts to Cuba come from & Sailor may be right that they originate from FA.

[greslogo]

I doubt Fat Albert can see beyond the horizon. It must be WAY up there to get that kind of coverage.

TV Marti is being broadcast from an airplane now. They flew it a few times not long ago and there has been no mention of it, since.

[jackd]

gres, good point about the horizon but would it not be the geo satelitte doing the watching and transmitting back to Fat *???

I was told they were broadcasting last week because the power had been off almost all night.

[cubafish]

Yes Fat Albert is WAY up there, up to 3000 ft depending on the wind velocity. The type of radar antenna used in FA was originally developed for Navy ships and the way it can see over the horizon is determined by a software program that takes into consideration the height the antenna. With the known height of the antenna, software in the receiver computes the curvature of the earth at that height which tells the operator the maximum distance the radar can target an object. Don't know how many kw's the antenna puts out, but I would not want to walk in front of the antenna if it were at ground level. :o

[cubafish]

Wonder what happened to the OP? He was so full of innocent entheusiam about taking his 20 ft boat to Cuba. Hopefully he is sitting back reading and having second thoughts about his safety and the safety of his passengers 8).

[Popup]

Thank You All Especially Cubafish Sailor For the
Valuable information. I Think we'll wait and go by plane for now. [smiley=anxious.gif] These Foruns are relly Great. the Internet has definately made a difference in the way the world runs. [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

[cubafish]

A wise decision. Perhaps in a year or three you will have a 28 ft or larger outboard <- the size I feel is the minimum for crossing to Cuba. I go in my boat, a 30 ft twin outboard in the summer when sea conditions are predictably calm, but I don't attempt that crossing from October thru April when sea conditions are predictably rough. I'll go to the Bahamas between October and April because that crossing is only 50 miles (vs Key West to Havana is 110 miles) and there are a lot of other boats crossing from Florida to the Bahamas year around (thus a greater safety factor), but when I go to Cuba October thru April, I fly. [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

[mellisas]

A wise decision. *Perhaps in a year or three you will have a 28 ft or larger outboard <- the size I feel is the minimum for crossing to Cuba. *I go in my boat, a 30 ft twin outboard in the summer when sea conditions are predictably calm, but I don't attempt that crossing from October thru April when sea conditions are predictably rough. *I'll go to the Bahamas between October and April because that crossing is only 50 miles (vs Key West to Havana is 110 miles) and there are a lot of other boats crossing from Florida to the Bahamas year around (thus a greater safety factor), but when I go to Cuba October thru April, I fly. * [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

see how important these forums are in some instances...

life saving when you think about it..

good on ya cubafish and sailor [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

[sailor]

Hey Popup, don't think I wasn't right there with you dreaming about going to Havana in a boat. There is nothing quite like it. It has been far too long since I have been there last and I surspect I'll be going again pretty soon.

It really is funtastic and you get to take sooooo much more stuff for family and friends and you get to enjoy the excitement of sneaking it past the aduanas in Marina Hemingway. (No, I won't publicize how I do this.)

I am hopeful that things may change soon but I am finding the politics insurmountable since G.W. has been at the helm. You are certainly not alone in this dream so don't get discouraged!

Check this out: http://www.defendcubasailors.com/